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Red lines

For discussion of all matters relating to the UK's departure from the European Union

Red lines

Postby dls » Sat Jul 01, 2017 9:32 am

A former member of te team negotiating our exit seems to be out to undermine the process.

He says that Davis is hamstrung because May will not allow any jurisdiction for the ECJ.
I find this odd.
I can live with all sorts of payments, compromises and fudges. My own particular red line is exactly the ECJ. To me 'Brexit _means_ no ECJ. I deal with their judgments constantly, and simply do not trust them. I do not point to any particular case or judge, but they are absolutely bound up with the Union. They are part and parcel of the EU. Leaving the EU is empty if we are still governed by their courts.
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Re: Red lines

Postby Hairyloon » Sat Jul 01, 2017 9:59 am

dls wrote:I deal with their judgments constantly, and simply do not trust them...

OK, why not?
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Re: Red lines

Postby Labrador » Sat Jul 01, 2017 2:08 pm

Your completely right of course the ECJ is part and parcel of the EU of which we chose to leave.
I think we have no alternative other than to walk away.
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Re: Red lines

Postby dls » Sun Jul 02, 2017 4:47 pm

I am unable to put a finger on it, and it may be pure prejudice.

All the same they are absolutely bound up with promoting the EU. I just cannot believe that they would be able to act impartially.
Our Lib-Dem leaders have believed they are being absolutely honest and objective in their defence of the EU. It is however with them a religious belief - beyond any rational question.
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Re: Red lines

Postby diy » Mon Jul 03, 2017 6:11 am

How is the ECJ accountable to a non-member state? We could choose the US supreme court just as validly?
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Re: Red lines

Postby Hairyloon » Mon Jul 03, 2017 9:13 am

diy wrote:How is the ECJ accountable to a non-member state? We could choose the US supreme court just as validly?

A fair point, and the US court ought to be impartial between the UK and the EU which appears to be a valid concern about the ECJ...
Except that I think I'd rather risk the bias than be subject to America's version of justice. :?
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Re: Red lines

Postby dls » Tue Jul 04, 2017 9:55 am

How is the ECJ accountable to a non-member state? We could choose the US supreme court just as validly?


Separation of powers - courts are not intended to be accountable. Some non-EU countries have accepted limited jurisdiction of the ECJ in order to be welcomed into various EU deals.
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Re: Red lines

Postby atticus » Wed Jul 05, 2017 9:48 am

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Re: Red lines

Postby diy » Wed Jul 05, 2017 3:43 pm

dls wrote:
How is the ECJ accountable to a non-member state? We could choose the US supreme court just as validly?


Separation of powers - courts are not intended to be accountable. Some non-EU countries have accepted limited jurisdiction of the ECJ in order to be welcomed into various EU deals.



So they are sort of like Emperors and kings then? sounds very democratic :?
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Re: Red lines

Postby Hairyloon » Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:08 pm

diy wrote:So they are sort of like Emperors and kings then? sounds very democratic :?


Courts are not supposed to be democratic.
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