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ECJ

For discussion of all matters relating to the UK's departure from the European Union

ECJ

Postby dls » Thu May 11, 2017 1:06 pm

I think that one element which may cause great difficulties in these negotiations will be the continued jurisdiction (or not) of the European Court of Justice.

For the full Brexiteers, it would be a complete Non-non.
For the EU, they will ask for it as a continuing guarantee of EU rights for EU citizens within the UK, and I can see it arising in other ways.
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Re: ECJ

Postby shootist » Thu May 11, 2017 2:28 pm

The more I read on this forum about issues arising with Brexit the more I am beginning to think that any 'negotiation' is pointless. I think both sides would be much better off if we just did a completely 'hard' Brexit and started up again with a clean slate to negotiate trade deals and other relationships with the EU on a clean canvas.
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Re: ECJ

Postby miner » Thu May 11, 2017 2:43 pm

Yes, I have also come to the conclusion that negotiating with these EUroclowns is a time-wasting exercise. That writing has been on the wall for a long time now.

Let's get get out and be shot of the EU in its entirety at the very earliest opportunity.

It is, after all, almost a year since the decision to leave was taken. During that time the UK has tried to reach agreement on some basic issues such as the rights of EU citizens living in the UK and the rights of UK citizens living in the EU. The EUroclowns haven't even wanted to begin to discuss anything on that subject, claiming that they were waiting for us to trigger Article 50. Well, the reality is that they haven't wanted to enter into any discussions on that even since Article 50 was triggered.

We need to get on with establishing the Trade Deals we need with the RoW without further delays ensuing from EU intransigence and incompetence.
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Re: ECJ

Postby atticus » Thu May 11, 2017 3:22 pm

If the UK should abandon its citizens resident in EU countries, how secure can those resident overseas but in non EU countries feel?

Should that concern any of us?
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Re: ECJ

Postby miner » Thu May 11, 2017 5:17 pm

atticus wrote:If the UK should abandon its citizens resident in EU countries, how secure can those resident overseas but in non EU countries feel?

Should that concern any of us?


What should concern us is how the self-serving - and anti UK - EU has been behaving over the whole residency issue.

The Remainer brigade always gets into emotional terminology over this issue. We are not "abandoning" our citizens. It is the EU which is abandoning its citizens to its own arrogance, intransigence and crass stupidity. It is shamelessly using the 3 million citizens of the other 27 countries as bargaining pawns in its attempt to secure a massive financial settlement from the UK upon its departure from the EU. At the end of the day it is clear that the EU doesn't really give a damn about their welfare. it just wants to use them as bargaining fodder in its amateurish gutter politics.

The simple fact is that as of now, whilst the EU has "demanded" rights for its citizens living in the UK (of which there are some 3 million) it has never at at time I'm aware of balanced that with a reciprocal offer for UK citizens (of which there are around 1 million) living in the 27 other EU countries. It is the EU and not the UK which is acting with appalling irresponsibility.

Our PM, in consideration of all the citizens so affected, offered to deal with this matter many months ago, but the EUroclowns turned a deaf ear to that eminently sensible and practical suggestion.

Maybe those affected should have sought to protect their own personal interests by applying for citizenship of the country they are currently resident in, rather than blindly assuming that their (temporary) resident status under the EU's current (but alterable) rules would go on indefinitely?

The Permanent Residency and Immigration Rules of almost every country change fairly regularly. The EU is NOT a Country. Individual countries must be allowed to set their own immigration and (temporary and permanent) residency rules.
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Re: ECJ

Postby dls » Thu May 11, 2017 7:50 pm

The thing for the moment, is that the EU is taking as read the superior court system it provides as a way of protecting EU citizens in the UK.

The Labour policy (manifesto?) of immediately granting 'full rights' to EU citizens fails to address the issue that what we understand as 'full rights' differs fundamentally from what the EU thinks are full rights.
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