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Non-resident Quitlings.

For discussion of all matters relating to the UK's departure from the European Union

Re: Non-resident Quitlings.

Postby miner » Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:23 pm

Now there's no need for your apparently endless snide comments. Respect the Boss' wishes, please. I'm trying to, and you can do the same.
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Re: Non-resident Quitlings.

Postby atticus » Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:33 pm

As I was saying, the US has a history of coming down hard on attempts to secede.
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Re: Non-resident Quitlings.

Postby miner » Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:17 pm

So, mon ami, have there been any attempts at secession within the USA since the American Civil War (which was, after all, 150 years ago)?

My detailed "knowledge", such as it is, of European History doesn't extend back much beyond the Abdication in 1936.
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Re: Non-resident Quitlings.

Postby atticus » Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:24 pm

That's a shame. Some knowledge of the Thirty Years War and the War of the Spanish Succession would help in understanding aspects of the German leanings towards federal arrangements.
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Re: Non-resident Quitlings.

Postby miner » Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:09 pm

I agree with you that it's a shame. (Geez, what have I just said ...? :) )

The simple fact is that I hated history as taught in school and wasn't interested in reading or rather absorbing the content of books about it. My dear wife is far more knowledgeable than I am about history, as she was more interested in it.
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Re: Non-resident Quitlings.

Postby Smouldering Stoat » Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:26 pm

miner wrote:So, mon ami, have there been any attempts at secession within the USA since the American Civil War (which was, after all, 150 years ago)?


Many.

For example, the Alaskan Independence Party has been a factor in state politics for some time, and a member of that party, Walter Hickel, was Governor from 1990 to 1994. There have been various moves for Californian independence, including some last year. The Georgian State Senate has passed resolutions that include the right to declare the US Constitution nullified under certain circumstances. Texas would seem to have the strongest claim to be able to secede, given that it was an independent republic before acceding to the Union. There's even been moves for Washington, Oregon, and the Canadian province of British Columbia to secede and form a new state of Cascadia.

None of these attempts have been successful. Despite being large, ethnically-diverse and in many respects somewhat cobbled-together, the US is one of the world's most stable countries. There's no reason to suppose that unions are inherently unstable: look at Russia, Germany, India, Brazil, Australia and the Netherlands, for example. The Union of Soviet Socialist Republics fell apart, but the Russian Soviet Federated Socialist Republic carried on in business as the Russian Federation. Yugoslavia fell apart but Germany was reunited. Sudan broke up but Yemen was unified. Malaysia seems to be doing pretty well for itself despite the secession of Singapore.

And looser groupings of states can survive for considerable periods: in the case of the Holy Roman Empire, in many respects the first EU, for nearly a millennium.

It is (genuinely) a pity you have not studied more history. It would have given you a much broader view.
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Re: Non-resident Quitlings.

Postby Hairyloon » Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:32 pm

We did the Reformation by King Henry in history. I cannot claim to have found any use for it.
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Re: Non-resident Quitlings.

Postby Smouldering Stoat » Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:39 pm

Seriously? The Henrician Reformation set in train a whole series of issues: the relative powers of the Crown and Parliament, and the extent to which England should engage with European politics - which resonate now.
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Re: Non-resident Quitlings.

Postby atticus » Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:40 pm

Is that all you studied in history?
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Re: Non-resident Quitlings.

Postby Hairyloon » Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:56 pm

atticus wrote:Is that all you studied in history?

Presumably not, but that's the bit I rememember. I must've remembered a bit more at the time: I managed to get a B.

Smouldering Stoat wrote:Seriously? The Henrician Reformation set in train a whole series of issues: the relative powers of the Crown and Parliament, and the extent to which England should engage with European politics - which resonate now.


I didn't mean that the reformation had been no use, only that my study of it has been.
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