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Mum and property

Postby Brownhills » Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:33 am

My mother and I held a property as joint tenants, she collected and received all the rent, I was just going to inherit it all after her death to avoid tax. She has of 18 months ago changed the ownership to tenants in common and now I only get half on her death.
She is going slightly mad and not looking after the property, so I want to now collect my half of the rent to look after the property and get back some of the money I will now lose after her death. We are not on speaking terms.
Can I estimate what she owes me in back rent, given my half, make a deduction for her looking after them for the last 18 months (like and agency fee) and make a money online claim for the rest?
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Re: Mum and property

Postby theycantdothat » Sat Mar 10, 2018 12:52 pm

You pose the sort of question which can only be answered when the full facts are known. What was agreed at the outset, what was set out in any document and the conduct of the parties are all relevant. Even with all the facts any opinion has to be tentative because there are no hard and fast rules in this type of situation.

Assuming there was no agreement that your mother should have all the income, when it comes to claiming your share of the rent received to date, you run into two hurdles. The first is the law of limitation which imposes time limits on claims. Its operation is a bit tricky when it comes to trust property, but you may be restricted to claiming six, possibly twelve, years' rent. The second is that by not claiming your share for so long you may be deemed to have gifted her your share. Whether you have gifted your share in future rent is difficult to say.

You can certainly take action to protect your interest, but the question is how you go about it. Unless the condition of the property is dire, going to court is not really to be recommended as in this sort of case costs are likely to be disproportionate to any benefit you obtain.
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Re: Mum and property

Postby atticus » Sat Mar 10, 2018 2:47 pm

This gives rise to all kinds of possibilities.

- application for order for sale, dividing net proceeds, plus accounting by mother for money.

- maybe even proprietary estoppel in respect of the whole freehold interest.

But the key thing is to get to the bottom of what was agreed when the property was purchased.
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Re: Mum and property

Postby dls » Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:20 am

You may not be on speaking terms now, but that should be sorted first. Do what you can do and have to do to get the relationship back on an even keel. The house is secondary.

Without doing that first, getting into a fight is probably ruinously expensive for you both.
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Re: Mum and property

Postby Brownhills » Sat Mar 31, 2018 5:31 pm

Thank you for the replies.
As I said in my first post, it was held as joint tenants to pass onto me with less fuss. Nothing in writing, only subtle hints that it would be mine on her death so I was a lucky girl and had to do her bidding in loo of this future gift.
I have done her bidding, and it's not been all that pleasant.

However that said I only want to claim my half of the rents from the 18 months ago it was changed from joint tenants to tenants in common, because i am not going to receive what had originally been promised so I think something now is better than half in the future.
Put it this way for you to understand.
Property worth £150,000 - half is £75,000. Brings in rent of £8,000 per year. Mum collects all the rent.
However, I think given the change in the way it is owned I should get £4,000 a year. If mum lives for another 10 years I dip out on £40,000 of rent, and only get £75,000
from the sale on her death.
In other words I mitigate my losses by claiming my half rent now. In the 18 months she owes me £6,000.This is just a fictional account, so you see what I mean or trying to say!
Can I do it by a money online claim with deductions for her agency and possible other out lays like insurance.

Getting back on speaking terms is never going to happen, she has just taken away her daughters inheritance out of malice and spite.
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Re: Mum and property

Postby dls » Sun Apr 01, 2018 7:13 am

Getting back on speaking terms is never going to happen, she has just taken away her daughters inheritance out of malice and spite.


Then get past it. In such a vital relationship, if the other will not give, then you have to.

You do not say who put the money in to buy the house. If (and obviously I do not know) your share was a gift from her, then in law she is very possibly entitled to have it back.
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Re: Mum and property

Postby Brownhills » Sun Apr 01, 2018 7:46 am

It has never been a vital relationship. Do not judge - some people should never have children. Before making another comment about my relationship please read about narcissistic parents and toxic parents. When reading also note that I was the scapegoat out of 3 girls.

She is entitled to get back the half she has. That was not the question.
Am I entitled to claim half the rent as it stands now. Please help.
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Re: Mum and property

Postby dls » Sun Apr 01, 2018 11:47 am

When property is taken on under a joint tnancy, each party owns all of it. It is not half and half.

When that joint tenancy is severed, half and half is not much more than a possible starting point. The notice itself may state the proportion asserted by the person giving the notice - awaiting either acceptance or rejection by the other party.
If no agreement is reached either might apply to the court uunder the Trusts of Land and Appointment of Trustees Act for a court to decide the proportions according to the evidence it finds. As I have said, evidence as to respective contributions could rapidly and easily displace any equal shares starting point.

. . but by that time, the huge expense might easily also make the process nugatory.

Mending the relationship is by far the most helpful thing anyone can suggest you can do. All parents have children with difficulties. All children have (had) parents with difficulties. A parent should forgive readily. A child must sometimes become the parent
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Re: Mum and property

Postby atticus » Sun Apr 01, 2018 5:47 pm

As said above, the key thing is to get to the bottom of what was agreed when the property was purchased.
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