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Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Employment and Discrimination Law

Re: Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Postby Smouldering Stoat » Mon May 15, 2017 8:39 pm

Scienke wrote:I agree smouldering stoat. It's not the employers fault if the employee recieves bad advice.

However, I do wonder what if any extra responsibilities may rest on the employer when they know they are offering a vulnerable and easily confused employee a legal settlement.


Their responsibility is to say "Here is our proposed agreement, take legal advice on it."
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Re: Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Postby atticus » Mon May 15, 2017 8:40 pm

Do you mean not made aware? That extra word conveys a lot, and suggests a failure in communication between union rep and adviser.
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Re: Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Postby Scienke » Mon May 15, 2017 8:50 pm

atticus wrote:Do you mean not made aware? That extra word conveys a lot, and suggests a failure in communication between union rep and adviser.


Yes from all that I know the legal advisor was not made aware of the autism. They knew virtually nothing about the member and it did occur to the family that perhaps the union rep was actually a little too close to the employer.
Last edited by Scienke on Mon May 15, 2017 9:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Postby Scienke » Mon May 15, 2017 9:04 pm

Smouldering Stoat wrote:
Scienke wrote:I agree smouldering stoat. It's not the employers fault if the employee recieves bad advice.

However, I do wonder what if any extra responsibilities may rest on the employer when they know they are offering a vulnerable and easily confused employee a legal settlement.


Their responsibility is to say "Here is our proposed agreement, take legal advice on it."


Purely as an example - the employer says to a confused and vulnerable person "Here's our proposed agreement. Take legal advice. But if you don't accept what we are offering we will claim that you stole something from us and sack you. Then we may get the police involved and you might go to prison."

I know we're getting away from reasonable adjustments here and into the territory of undue pressure. The vulnerable/confused/scared employee didn't have the presence of mind to ask the legal advisor if this pressure from the employer was allowed or acceptable, (because they believed that the employer was all powerful). The advisor didn't know that this pressure was being applied so they couldn't have asked about it. Are you suggesting that the employer is protected just because the employee had the opportunity to ask but didn't?
Last edited by Scienke on Mon May 15, 2017 9:23 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Postby Hairyloon » Mon May 15, 2017 9:11 pm

Smouldering Stoat wrote:Dave receives poor advice from his legal adviser, Eve, about a settlement agreement. That advice was not provided by his employer. Eve owes Dave a duty of care, and it is a requirement that Eve has insurance...


Scienke wrote:
Hairyloon wrote:Was the union aware of the autism? Is it not they that should have made the reasonable adjustment?


The union in this case appeared completely fractured and incapable of communicating with its own different departments...

Yes, that does appear to be a good working definition of "union" these days...
The workplace rep knew that she was autistic but the unions legal department who were dealing with the settlement agreement were not aware that they were communicating with an autistic person

At what point were you aware that they were not aware?
I'm not sure that matters: it is the union that owes the duty of care on the legal advice. If any part of that union fails in that duty, the whole of the union should be accountable.
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Re: Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Postby atticus » Mon May 15, 2017 9:14 pm

Hmmmm ... It is the adviser that owes the duty, has to be insured, etc.
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Re: Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Postby Scienke » Mon May 15, 2017 9:19 pm

But the advisor can't help it if they're​ not told. My neice has a good family support network around her so she had people in her corner to steer her right. But not every vulnerable person is so lucky. In fact, in my experience, most vulnerable people have nobody who cares about them.
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Re: Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Postby blig » Mon May 15, 2017 9:49 pm

Going back to the original question, a disabled employee could resign but continue to carry out work on a freelance basis, no longer as an employee. The duty to make reasonable adjustments still applies to this worker. There are other scenarios as well.
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Re: Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Postby Scienke » Mon May 15, 2017 10:09 pm

Interesting point. What other scenarios do you think might arise?

If someone was no longer an employee but wanted to make a claim for failure to make reasonable adjustments, I wonder would that claim still be made at the employment tribunal or would it need to be in the county court, given that he is no longer an employee.

I don't know if you can go to an employment tribunal if you are not actually an employee.
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Re: Reasonable adjustments when employment has ended?

Postby Hairyloon » Mon May 15, 2017 10:11 pm

Scienke wrote:But the advisor can't help it if they're​ not told...

The advice comes from the union ergo the union is the advisor. The union was told ergo the advisor was told.
If the union cannot find its arse with both hands and a book of anatomy, then who's fault is that?
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